Thank you Tash and Nancy for a great conversation. I could see Woolf's painting of Kew Gardens as if it were framed in front of me; its vivid colours and impressionist atmosphere anchored in place and in time by the snail and its tiny movements in the garden bed, the characters and their thoughts fading in and out, becoming transparent, the tea house at the edge of the scene, out of focus. The trees, the sky.
It reminded me of your last conversation with Robert about 'The Lady In The Looking Glass'. Whereas that story was framed within the reflection of a mirror, and presenting a mirror-image of a woman, this one intricately studies a moment in time of a scene captured within a frame, with the only things to move out of the frame being thoughts and noises.
I loved this comment Alia - I hadn't thought of that connection between 'Kew Gardens' and 'The Lady in the Looking Glass'. How interesting! Yes, both involve a type of framing. In TLITLG, the gilt edge of the looking glass frame cuts Isabella off as she walks away down the garden path, while in KG people are also cut off as they walk out of the metaphorical frame of the artwork; their conversation drops off or they diminish in size...
This time I did read the story first so enjoyed the conversation so much more. Thanks to both of you - so much depth I missed! I'm glad I wasn't the only one concerned for the snail. I didn't give the thrush another thought! ... until Ronald's comment ... oh dear. To distract myself I'm now on a deep dive into Vanessa Bell. Delicious, all of it. And I'm so looking forward to reading Lighthouse again.
Thanks for taking the time to read the story AND listen to our conversation! Vanessa Bell is WONDERFUL! Enjoy. I hope you enjoy revisiting TTL. I'm really looking forward to it!
A device for detecting spirits. Doesn't that have a resonance for any writer of stories? A bit like the ink-squirting crayfish in Lady in the Looking Glass? If the story is "about" something (a dodgy concept with VW) but: the snail is directly in touch with the world. But each of the humans is in some way 'out of it'. The first couple in memory, the old man in delusion, the lower middle class woman in a sort of mystic ecstasy (until reminded of her tea) and the young couple in love.
Thanks for the info that V and TS Eliot were friendly, because I'm not up on who knew who. But the Londons of Dalloway and The Waste Land do seem to be suburbs of the same city.
Oh, I like that - the snail being directly in touch with the world and the humans being out of it, in some way. Yes, VW and TS Eliot certainly knew each other and moved in the same circles. And in fact, some of Eliot's post Prufrock poems were published by Hogarth at about the same time as 'Kew Gardens'. Virginia described Eliot as 'very intellectual, intolerant, with strong views of his own, & a poetic creed.'
Struck me that the opening is from the snail's point of view? Flowers seen from underneath . I also worried about that thrush. Main feature of thrushes apart from the song is they hunt snails. Reason for the disappear ance of Mr Snail? Or am I reading too much into this?
Aha! I missed the thrush. Certainly he is down on the ground 'in the shadow' of flowers... Oh dear! I also noticed that the colours mentioned in the first paragraph are the three primary colours but in the final paragraph they have been mixed and we have green and pink and so on... Nancy and I did allude to this - Nancy noted that there are different colours in the final para but it's only now that I see that we start with the artist's palate and end with the painting... perhaps.
Your post sent me straight to my bookshelf Tash and there it was (amazing how in the higgledy-piggledy of books one knows precisely where to find the beloveds)! I studied Kew Gardens as part of my OU degree years ago and now I’m going to settle in to first re-read and then listen in. Thank you and happy Sunday!
It's uncanny how easily we locate our favourites in the bookshelf even after years and years! Thank you for this lovely comment and also your beautiful post, which I just saw! I am about to head out for the day but will give it a proper read when I'm back at my desk.
What a treat Tash - I love that story, it's sort of my local short story as I live quite near the gardens, and the aspects/questions you raise in your post have already brought so much to my memory of reading it... Shall be listening to your conversation with Nancy with great pleasure, thank you!
Oh excellent! I love that this is a local short story for you. Apparently Woolf went to Kew Gardens all the time (there are frequent references in her diary). Meanwhile, on the other side of the planet, I'm busy googling images of the Palm House...
Thank you Tash and Nancy for a great conversation. I could see Woolf's painting of Kew Gardens as if it were framed in front of me; its vivid colours and impressionist atmosphere anchored in place and in time by the snail and its tiny movements in the garden bed, the characters and their thoughts fading in and out, becoming transparent, the tea house at the edge of the scene, out of focus. The trees, the sky.
It reminded me of your last conversation with Robert about 'The Lady In The Looking Glass'. Whereas that story was framed within the reflection of a mirror, and presenting a mirror-image of a woman, this one intricately studies a moment in time of a scene captured within a frame, with the only things to move out of the frame being thoughts and noises.
I loved this comment Alia - I hadn't thought of that connection between 'Kew Gardens' and 'The Lady in the Looking Glass'. How interesting! Yes, both involve a type of framing. In TLITLG, the gilt edge of the looking glass frame cuts Isabella off as she walks away down the garden path, while in KG people are also cut off as they walk out of the metaphorical frame of the artwork; their conversation drops off or they diminish in size...
This time I did read the story first so enjoyed the conversation so much more. Thanks to both of you - so much depth I missed! I'm glad I wasn't the only one concerned for the snail. I didn't give the thrush another thought! ... until Ronald's comment ... oh dear. To distract myself I'm now on a deep dive into Vanessa Bell. Delicious, all of it. And I'm so looking forward to reading Lighthouse again.
Thanks for taking the time to read the story AND listen to our conversation! Vanessa Bell is WONDERFUL! Enjoy. I hope you enjoy revisiting TTL. I'm really looking forward to it!
A device for detecting spirits. Doesn't that have a resonance for any writer of stories? A bit like the ink-squirting crayfish in Lady in the Looking Glass? If the story is "about" something (a dodgy concept with VW) but: the snail is directly in touch with the world. But each of the humans is in some way 'out of it'. The first couple in memory, the old man in delusion, the lower middle class woman in a sort of mystic ecstasy (until reminded of her tea) and the young couple in love.
Thanks for the info that V and TS Eliot were friendly, because I'm not up on who knew who. But the Londons of Dalloway and The Waste Land do seem to be suburbs of the same city.
Oh, I like that - the snail being directly in touch with the world and the humans being out of it, in some way. Yes, VW and TS Eliot certainly knew each other and moved in the same circles. And in fact, some of Eliot's post Prufrock poems were published by Hogarth at about the same time as 'Kew Gardens'. Virginia described Eliot as 'very intellectual, intolerant, with strong views of his own, & a poetic creed.'
Struck me that the opening is from the snail's point of view? Flowers seen from underneath . I also worried about that thrush. Main feature of thrushes apart from the song is they hunt snails. Reason for the disappear ance of Mr Snail? Or am I reading too much into this?
Aha! I missed the thrush. Certainly he is down on the ground 'in the shadow' of flowers... Oh dear! I also noticed that the colours mentioned in the first paragraph are the three primary colours but in the final paragraph they have been mixed and we have green and pink and so on... Nancy and I did allude to this - Nancy noted that there are different colours in the final para but it's only now that I see that we start with the artist's palate and end with the painting... perhaps.
Maybe the snail sees the bright, simple primary colours. The humans see the more complex arty type ones.
Your post sent me straight to my bookshelf Tash and there it was (amazing how in the higgledy-piggledy of books one knows precisely where to find the beloveds)! I studied Kew Gardens as part of my OU degree years ago and now I’m going to settle in to first re-read and then listen in. Thank you and happy Sunday!
It's uncanny how easily we locate our favourites in the bookshelf even after years and years! Thank you for this lovely comment and also your beautiful post, which I just saw! I am about to head out for the day but will give it a proper read when I'm back at my desk.
Have a lovely Sunday 😊
What a treat Tash - I love that story, it's sort of my local short story as I live quite near the gardens, and the aspects/questions you raise in your post have already brought so much to my memory of reading it... Shall be listening to your conversation with Nancy with great pleasure, thank you!
Oh excellent! I love that this is a local short story for you. Apparently Woolf went to Kew Gardens all the time (there are frequent references in her diary). Meanwhile, on the other side of the planet, I'm busy googling images of the Palm House...
Isn't that strange/lovely to think of?!?
KG is wonderful although paradoxically I don't go enough because it's too near.
I shall associate it more with Virginia now....